It was good being with you guys this weekend. I am looking forward to what God is going to do within the church Body there. You are blessed by being such a part of a great group of believers. Thanks for your input here. Feel free to return anytime and express your concerns.

Brother Roger,

I pray your analysis is correct, especially about getting to the Orlando convention.

Brother Stuart,

Thanks for your input. Certainly will look to those links.

Blessings,
Tim

If the recommendations are approved, IMB wouldn’t “send” missionaries in the U.S. in the sense that they do overseas, so that wouldn’t be a factor in the 5,000. (Per either a twitter, blog, or blog comment response by Dr. Rankin one day last week.)

Old line conventions:

As a result of the implementation of the task force’s plan, the possible paths for funding evangelism/church planting in the “old line” state conventions is as follows:

Possible path #1 — ISOLATION: With the NAMB funding gone, the state conventions will “take over” evangelism and church planting within their own states. Because the state conventions have to adsorb that portion of the funding which was previously received from the NAMB via the “cooperative agreements”, the states will likely be forced to cut back on the CP funds they send to Nashville.

Possible path #2 – MARGINALIZATION: The NAMB will be taking over and managing the evangelism activities which were formerly joint operations with the states. The net shift in the work of the state conventions, as envisioned by the task force, is the elimination of the “core area” of evangelism/church-planting coupled with the augmentation of the “church relations job” of CP promotion and stewardship education. This marginal shift in the states’ mandate is consistent with the perception is that states are “bloated and bureaucratic” and their role in SBC life, over time, will continue to recede from “front line” activities. If one wanted to setup of a scheme to marginalize the role of the states this would be a good start: Strip them of key assignments and backfill with third order stuff such as fund raising that is more suitably sourced to vendors on per-job basis.

Pioneer state conventions:

ELIMINATION: As envisioned by the task force, the flows to the pioneer conventions which are now received via the cooperative agreements will cease. These include (a) cooperative agreements for “approved positions” which currently support the lion’s share of the salaries of people working for the state conventions and (b) cooperative agreements for “appointed positions” which currently support the lion’s share of evangelism and church planting positions in the pioneer states. Eliminating the cooperative agreements will in the first instance defund the state operations causing the state conventions to fold. Eliminating the cooperative agreements in the second instance will cause the church planting / evangelism work in the pioneer states to come under the direct auspices of the NAMB rendering the state conventions unnecessary — except for any “residual” work the pioneer state conventions are doing other than church planting and/or evangelism.

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I like the idea of tightening up the “span of control” for employees doing work. I like the idea of the NAMB being able to rationalize the work of evangelism and church planting and put boots on the ground in critical areas independent of state boundaries. One task remaining for the task force is to “fill in the blanks” in their interim report so that that by the time we get to Orlando the benefits of a “released” NAMB won’t be accomplished by marginalizing/destroying the state conventions.

Roger Simpson
Oklahoma City OK

“in a missional community, the church is God’s sent people. That means when everything is stripped away – the building, the events, the activities, the leaders, and other identifying markers for the church – the people are the church and church is the people. Therefore, wherever God’s people are corporately or individually, there is the church. Church is at home, in the car, in the restaurant, the beach – wherever God’s people find themselves in their daily lives.

Another practical difference can be seen in the practices of the general American Christian populace. American Christians cannot be distinguished in any significant way from secular culture. Christian lifestyles and time-styles, although slightly Christianized, are virtually the same as the culture around them.There are also no noticeable differences between Christians and their secular counterparts in areas of morality and ethics. Dawn Haglund states that the church has completely adopted American culture”

http://www.theofframp.org/missional_comm.html

So Instead of addressing the problem most Christians have we start a new community and rename it misssional, and leave those who have fallen behind. Reminds me when the progressive movement changed revolution to evolution, or the restaurant that had bad food changed its name and put up a “new management” sign..

But thats just me. I believe everything has become to political and that is what divides. Its the word of God that we all fellowship in. Its the word of God that will bring the people together. How it gets there really doesnt matter.

Good to have you down south Tim.

Good points. I am just not as convinced as you that this GCRTF vision statement is to be used only for the SBC. If you remember when the Baptist Sunday School Board changed its name to Lifeway they did it because the old name was too confined to reach out to a vast audience. Much of the same reasoning going on with the GCRTF in this presentation. And all one has to do now is walk into Lifeway to see the influence the at large Christian world has had on them. The Shack, TD Jakes, etc. etc.

Blessings,
Tim

Help me understand your concern that there is no baptism to the GCR. It seems like the entire movement, being a movement comprised of Southern Baptists for Southern Baptists, entails all our important biblical distinctives, baptist among them (as well as regenerate church membership, priesthood of believers, etc). In what way, then, is it withouth baptism?

I hear what your saying, and appreciate your response, but to be honest, I do not think the wording is generic such to warrant concern. The context of the document makes it explicit that missional is about (1) understanding the lost in our backyard on page 10, which I take to amount to knowing those you are trying to reach, (2) members advancing the gospel in their communities (page 11) using that understanding entailed in (1), and (3) in a way that leads (logically and sequentially) to an increased committement to global evangelism, on page 11.

Thanks Tim, I really appreciate your willingness to help me think this through. I have not read the whole document, so there may be vagueness in other places I am missing.
Adam

Your point is well taken about the “Gospel”. You and I understand that we are speaking about the Jesus of the Scripture that was and is and will always be God. However, the mere wording without a grasp of what we are speaking is, as I said, very generic. As Baptist we believe that the Gospel does not stop with the presentation. Any Great Commission Resurgence without Baptism is not a biblical Great Commission.

Brother Roger,

Great find. The articles are very insightful. I will post them here for others to link.

Al Mohler, President of Southern Baptist Theological Seminary, on state cooperative agreements

Glen Land, former State Missions Director of Minnesota-Wisconsin Baptist Convention, on state cooperative agreements

Danny Akin, President of Southeastern Baptist Theological Seminary, on GCRTF report

Scott Brewer, Pastor of Meadowbrook Church and President of the Northwest Baptist Convention, on GCRTF report

Bob White, Executive Director and Treasurer of the Georgia Baptist Convention, on new name for SBC giving

Norman Jameson, editor of the Biblical Recorder, the newsjournal of the Baptist State Convention of North Carolina, on new name for SBC giving

Hope these help.

Blessings,
Tim