Paul told Timothy to be “instant in season and out of season.” The New American Standard Bible translates 2 Timothy 4:2 “Preach the word; be ready in season and out of season;” When I entered the ministry I was instructed by an old pastor to be ready on every occasion to give a gospel message. I asked what was meant by a “gospel message” and he told me it was the “good news”. Not a good word but the good news. It seems that we have changed the definition of “the good news” today to a different meaning in order to accommodate society’s new right: the right not to be offended. Dr. Albert Mohler has a great article on this new right and you can read about it here. However I would like to address something that took place on July 4th that did cause an uproar, but not one that would be expected.
On July 4th 2009, Dr. Rick Warren, Senior Pastor of Saddleback Church and a voice listened to and respected in the evangelical world at large and by many in the Southern Baptist Convention, was the keynote speaker at the 46th Annual convention of the Islamic Society of North America (you can see his entire transcript here). This event was a gathering of 45,000 Muslims in our nations capital with many sessions of interest to Muslims residing in the U S. What Dr. Warren addressed should be of upmost importance to us.
Dr. Warren addressed the need for Christians and Muslims to unite in order to address various issues that we have in common. I would like to point out the things that Dr. Warren said we have in common and then address these issues and how we can handle them.
Dr. Warren, in typical evangelical style, presented a talk with four points. He presented four areas he believed, as Christians and Muslims, we could find agreement and thus come together to address these needs in the world.
“The first thing we have to do is what I call on Muslims and Christians together to model; what it means to respect the dignity of every person.”
I stand in agreement with Dr. Warren on this point. We should never forsake the dignity ascribed to individuals as human beings. This includes children whose lives have been arranged by their parents to be married. The ISNA has on their website a link for Matrimonal. This link provides an online type of match making service for singles. To be fair, it does appear to be something that single men and women may frequent to find a Muslim husband or wife. However, the wording of the site gives cause for concern. It reads, “This website provides a secure Islamic platform for single Muslims and/or their parents to create a profile and interact with other members in this database.” (Emphasis mine)
How many Muslim daughters are promised to Muslim sons without either of them being old enough to make that decision on their own? Where is the dignity of human beings being promoted in that practice? Did Dr. Warren address some of the various items where dignity was not being promoted by Christians or Muslims? No, he just threw this statement out there and never addressed where dignity was being destroyed.
Also, Dr. Warren referenced something that is so confusing I am not sure anyone caught it at the convention. He stated, “As the Holy Scriptures tell us since we are created in the image of God, each person has intrinsic value and dignity.“ This begs the question: What Scripture did he reference as “Holy”? Was he referencing the Qur’an? Did those attending believe he was referencing the Bible or did they believe he was referencing the Qur’an? I would agree that we ought to treat individuals with dignity, but we are not able to establish this doctrine by referencing, as our authority, the Qur’an. While the Qur’an may advocate that we all have dignity as human beings, it certainly strays a long way away from that ideal when it begins to address women’s roles in society.
“The second thing we need to do together is we need to work together to restore civility to civilization.”
I agree 100% with the statement. We certainly do need to work hard to restore civility to civilization. However, once again he does not state any particular events where this is happening. He presents a type of harshness within our debates and this seems to be his basis for the statement. But, Dr. Warren seems to forget that we live in a nation in which the first amendment guarantees the right to free speech. Dr. Mohler’s article I referenced earlier explains better how Dr. Warren’s desire here is illogical. The only way we can dictate one speak in a civil tone is to remove the free speech clause.
“Now there is a third thing that we need to do together and I think we can do these, hand in hand, and that is promoting peace, promoting freedom, and protecting freedom, particularly the freedom of speech and the freedom of religion.”
This statement is so full of contradiction it collapses on itself. Dr. Warren makes certain he desires us to speak civilly to each other then he calls for us to protect our freedom of speech. As I said earlier, you cannot have it both ways. Dr. Warren also positions himself as a defender of freedom of religion. I agree with his statement here. Dr. Warren spoke about his Baptist ancestors that fought in the Revolutionary War in order for us to have the freedoms we enjoy today. He then says, “those freedoms are still under attack by people who don’t want you to talk about the things you want to talk about and the things that I want to talk about, or anybody else and they want us to just talk about what they want us to talk about.”
These freedoms must be maintained. However, we are at the brink of losing the freedom to express our view that Jesus Christ is the only way to heaven. Let’s face it: Dr. Warren was in the prime location to be free to express that view and he did not do it. Why? Only he can answer that question.
“Finally, I believe that there are some problems in this world that are never going to be solved by the governments of the world. I call these problems the global giants.”
The five “global giants” that he said could not be solved by government intervention:
“Number 1 is the problem of Conflict. War, confrontation, hostilities, terrorism, refugee camps. The second big problem that is all around the world is corruption. The third biggest problem on the planet is poverty. The fourth big problem is disease. the 5th biggest problem in Illiteracy.“
These five “global giants” certainly can be solved. However, we need to answer a question. If the government cannot solve them, can religion? I say religion and government can solve these problems. Notice that I said can solve them. These five giants will be solved when we work together to solve them in a one-world religious order. Certainly I do not advocate a one-world religious order because we all know when that comes about it will be headed up by the Anti-Christ. I am not against solving the problems of wars. However, our Lord told us that wars would remain. It seems that Dr. Warren has allowed his desire to end these events to overshadow his knowledge of Scripture. In Matthew 24:6 Jesus told us that many of the things Dr. Warren wants us to bring to an end are events that take place before the return of our Lord. I am all for trying to bring about change in order to stop the corruption and other ills of society we see. However, we must remember that all of this comes about because of sin, sin in the unregenerate hearts of the world leaders.
Thus, Dr. Warren had a great opportunity to make this point but he missed it because it appears he did not want to offend the 45,000 Muslims that gathered to hear him. Paul’s instructions to Timothy was to be “ready in season and out of season”. I believe Dr. Warren missed an opportunity to promote the fix to the needs of the world. He was not ready out of season. Could it be that he did not desire to offend his Muslim audience? If that is the reason, Dr. Warren needs to remember that the Gospel is offensive. He should never present it offensively, but when the Gospel is presented it is an exclusive truth not a truth equal to other truths. I pray for Dr. Warren as he has a platform that many will never have. I pray that he does not allow his concern for the masses to be his alone. I pray that his concern for the masses is coming from the heart of God and not Dr. Warren’s fleshly heart of empathy. May he remember that God’s heart does not send a confusing message.
Brother Tim,
You seem to very gentle on Rick. We find it politically expedient to forget the words of our prophets….
Joshua 24:15 “If it is disagreeable in your sight to serve the LORD, choose for yourselves today whom you will serve: whether the gods which your fathers served which were beyond the River, or the gods of the Amorites in whose land you are living; but as for me and my house, we will serve the LORD.”
Blessings,
Chris
Brother Chris,
I give Dr. Warren the benefit of the doubt because I do not know if someone came to him privately to ask about his faith and he shared the Gospel with that person. I also, will probably never be asked to address people he addresses. But, if I ever do get the opportunity, you can rest assured that I do not care if I was called on to address the best ways to make tomato sandwiches, the Gospel will be presented without compromise and without apology. I already have my thoughts together on it. Life is like a tomato sandwich. The bread represents the people you encounter in life. Many are good people and if you look at bread you will see the interweaving of the flour that has been placed together through the process of making bread. We as people are placed together and our lives are interwoven. To make a tomato sandwich you need mayonnaise. This represents the pleasures of life. Some enjoy more pleasure in life than others and some enjoy different kinds of pleasures. For me it would be Duke’s mayonnaise. Why? Because a tomato sandwich is not as enjoyable as it should be without Duke’s mayonnaise. Once you get those two ingredients you do not have a complete tomato sandwich without a tomato. The tomato represents Jesus. You see a tomato sandwich is not a tomato sandwich without a tomato. You are not enjoying and living life without Jesus. Regardless of how much you may think you are enjoying a tomato sandwich it is nothing but bread and mayonnaise. It is the same with life. Regardless of how much you may believe you have a full life, it is not complete without Jesus.
This way I have not violated my assigned task and I have presented the real meaning of life. Dr. Warren could have done something similar if he would have just thought through this invitation. I pray for him and do not want anyone to think I do not believe God is using him. I just believe he missed and excellent opportunity to present the Gospel message.
Blessings,
Tim
Tim, the Bible also says, “Blessed are the peacemakers.” Have you ever had people shooting at you? I have. And anyone who has knows that while the peace of God that passes all understanding (which comes in a relationship with Jesus) is best, the absence of conflict ain’t bad.
Some people have a gift and a personality which makes them effective witnesses through direct confrontation. maybe you are one of those, I don’t know. But others of us (and yes, I use the word “us” because that is possibly the only small way in which I am like Rick Warren) are more effective through finding common ground and building on that.
I am curious: do you have any friends who are Muslim? I do; and I know I cannot argue them into faith in Christ any more than they can argue me in faith in Islam. But I can show them care, and concern, and love, and seek to build relationships with them through which a Christian lifestyle may be witnessed. So I for one affirm what Dr. Warren has done, and think it is Biblical.
Interesting: my anti-spam word is “kindness.”
John
Brother Tim,
You have made me hungry with all this tomato sandwich business. I like tomatoes very much!
I guess as we learn to play politics we sometimes lose focus about what is really happening as we look to the audience. If Christ is truly the bread of life (tomato in your analogy),then the bread must be served or else you die.
John 6:48-50 “I am the bread of life. (49) “Your fathers ate the manna in the wilderness, and they died. (50) “This is the bread which comes down out of heaven, so that one may eat of it and not die.”
Sometimes I see religious men that are content with talking about their bread, but hesitent to serve it.
Blessings,
Chris
Chris and Tim
This has to be a first. A criticism that we are not harsh enough.
:-)
Allow me to rephrase that. Maybe “harsh enough” is not a correct assessment, but “critical enough?”
Brother John,
I am logged into the admin part of the blog so I do not have a anti-spam word. Because of this, I will use your word (kindness) as I respond. :)
Seriously, I believe you are correct that some are confrontational and others are not. However, you seem to overlook that the Gospel is the Gospel regardless of one being confrontational or not. The Gospel can be presented in a confrontational way, but it can also be presented as mere information for others to receive. Certainly, if I were in a one-on-one situation with someone that was antagonistic toward Christianity, I would be confrontational. However, standing before a group of people at a conference billed as being pluralistic, makes me believe that a matter of information would be very appropriate. It would also be appropriate to express that this I believe this truth is an exclusive truth and can be exclusively yours if you would receive it.
That is not confrontational. I listened to one speaker tell about how Muslim men left their families in India and worked next to Mexican immigrant women. In working next to them began a relationship and then married them thus beginning an Islamic sect in Northern California. If that is not confrontational to hear, then how could me expressing, as an invited guest, my views concerning exclusive truth be confrontational?
Blessings,
Tim
Brother Robin,
I thought the same thing as I was penning the comment. You big meanie, gone soft! :)
Brother John,
I realized that I did not finish answering your question. Yes, I do have friends that are Muslim. I have neighbors that are Muslim as well and I am trying to develop a relationship with them. I have a Physician that is Muslim and he did surgery on me to remove a benign growth. My wife asked me if I was going to witness to him and I told her I believe I would wait until after the surgery. :) I have a Brother-in-law that holds to a Sadducee Jewish belief system. He was not born Jewish but he has picked up on this belief system. I have homosexual friends and strive to keep a relationship with them. All of this to tell you that I am not exactly isolated from the lost world. These people are lost and on their way to hell without Jesus Christ. John, how good of a friend is that Muslim that you have? I presume him to be a good friend. Let me ask you how you would feel if that friend would die before you share the Gospel with him? John, I love my daughter. If I merely allowed her to live in my home and never shared Christ with her would she see enough about be to want to be a Christian? Because she is in my home, I would think she would. However, if I never shared with her how she could be saved would she ever repent and turn from herself and turn to God? I do not believe she would. It is the same with my friends. They do not live in my home and they certainly do not see my heart like my daughter would. Thus, my obligation to share the Gospel with them compels me even more. John, Ezekiel 3:18 is as true today as it was in 570 BC.
Blessings,
Tim
Now my anti-span word is “patience.” Is it possible that Dr. Warren viewed his message an an opening through which (eventually) more witness can be built? In other words, maybe he believed that he didn’t have to “shoot his load” in this one time. Maybe he knew (or at least believed) that to introduce his “views concerning exclusive truth” (as you phrase it) would not only be a violation of the hospitality through which he was invited to speak, but also that it could serve as a building block for future witness, when through a relationship he or someone else could more effectively witness. In other words: a patient, long term strategy.
John
Brother Chris,
Brother Robin and I have decided we will just become more critical of you.
Which brings me to a point. Can you tell me who the second from the left, bare chested, sized 8 slim, little fellow is? Also, could you tell me if he was old enough to shave? One other thing. If he was old enough to shave could you express to me why he wasn’t?
:)
Blessings,
Tim
Brother John,
Great thoughts. However, would you say that Dr. Warren would have the possibility of addressing those same 45,000 Muslims again? I do not believe you would say that and that is my whole point. He will never be asked to address that audience again. Will he be asked to address future conventions of the ISNA? I doubt very seriously he will. However, if he does he certainly can never say anything any different than he did the first time because then he will be in violation of the hospitality through which he was invited to speak.
Also, a patient long term strategy is good for us to think about concerning building buildings and implementing outreach plans. However, when placed before 45,000 people that believe truth is pluralistic somebody somewhere needs to say, here is exclusive truth.
Blessings,
Tim
Tim,
I did not receive your second message to me until I posted my last one. I am not sure what I said that makes you think I am against witnessing to Muslims, but whatever it was–either I misspoke or you misunderstood. I simply postulated that, given different spiritual gifts and personalities, there are ways to be more effective than immediate confrontation, and that perhaps Dr. Warren is trying to build some relationship through which a Christian witness may be offered. That seems to be exactly what you are suggesting re: your Muslim friend; and that not all times are the best time to witness, as your decision about sharing with your Muslim doctor suggests. Why can’t you give Rick Warren the same leeway, that (1) he thinks witness (at least his witness) is more effective through relationship than confrontation, and (2) that there is a right moment for direct, verbal witness, and there are wrong moments for it?
John
Tim,
I believe that God–the God who reveals Himself in Jesus Christ, not the one of Islam–has the power to move the Islamic Society to ivite Warren again, or for that matter, Franklin Graham, or anyone else He so chooses. Humanly speaking, I have no idea how likely it is that they will invite Warren again; but I expect it is more likely than it would be had he used the podium to witness about Jesus as the Messiah and Christianity as the only way to God. As it is, and if he never addresses another Muslim, you never know where seeds were planted when Warren spoke, and how that may play out.
If Rick Warren had a reputation for confrontational evangelism, do you think they would have invited him in the first place? With Muslims, we have a lot of uneducating to do–because for many of them, especially first generation immigrants from the Middle East, their understanding of “Christianity” is bound up with the Crusades.
John
Brother John,
I am in no way implying that you are against witnessing to Muslims. I believe you are one that believes Christ is the only way to heaven and that a relationship with Him is vital for eternal life. I believe where you and I differ is the urgency in which this is presented. As to my physician, please note the smiley face behind that sentence. He got the gospel before the surgery.
Brother, God did not call me to present my knowledge–ask anyone that knows me–I have no knowledge to present. Knowledge have I none, but what I have I give to others.
Blessings,
Tim
Brother John,
Rick has the leeway… he just was silent concerning the gospel in this instance. I’m sure we all have had those moments of silence. He may be waiting for the payoff pitch later….who knows. His strategy may be to get deeper into the perishing before he preaches the Word.
I have many Muslim friends, and they are not silent about their beliefs. If I understand what Christ has said in His word,..their only hope is to hear the gospel….how will they know without a preacher.
Blessings,
Chris
Brother Tim,
I can’t get to Facebook because of the filters I have put into our systems….I’ll have to view the pic when I get back to the house.
I’m sure it will be worth the wait :)
Blessings,
Chris
Brother John,
I posted while you were responding. Sorry. I have matters that I need to address so I will comment here and then be gone for some time.
Your comment in #14 is what I am addressing. First, you are correct, the God who reveals himself in Jesus Christ certainly can work out another invitation for Rick Warren. With that said, does it matter what Dr. Warren said then? If we truly believe that the God that reveals himself in Jesus Christ is sovereign then I can stand before Muslims and tell them that Mohammad was a false prophet and if it is God’s will He will orchestrate for me another time to stand before this same group of people. However, I also know that if I pull my punches because I desire to be accepted this same God that reveals himself in Jesus Christ will shut that door tight.
You then say that Dr. Warren sowed seeds? What seeds of the gospel were sown? The only thing he said was that he was a follower of Jesus Christ. That is it. But then you end with the crusades. Do you realize that you just gave rationalization for Americans to hate Muslims because of 9/11?
Look, we just disagree here. I believe Dr. Warren missed a golden opportunity to present the Gospel. I believe he did it in the name of pragmatism.
Blessings,
Tim
Tim,
I believe I have found the crux of the problem here…Rick Warren used only four points when he should have used five!
:-D
Sola Gratia.
Seriously though…
I think what I see as the issue here is a pattern developing in Pastor Rick’s ministry. When on the national seen, he has represented Christians as being more accomodationist and inclusivist rather than prophetic and exclusivist.
I am concerned any time we as ambassadors for Christ fear or fail to proclaim the clear truths of Scripture, especially the Gospel of Jesus Christ.
Certainly not every encounter is a confrontational, finger pointing Gospel invitation…but some, or many more, should be.
Sola Gratia
Tim,
I do not know the complete text of what Rick Warren said, so I do not know how he was introduced, what he said about being a believer in Christ Jesus, or anything else–in fact, I had not heard about this until I read of it here. God has chosen to work through people, so certainly it matters what is said–both verbally and non-verbally. When you and I are both long forgotten, people will still remember the Godly wisdom of Francis of Assisi, who said, “Preach the Gospel at all times and when necessary use words.” So if he is correct, or even close to it, Rick Warren’s presence was itself a witness, when a more direct approach would probably have been rejected. After all: how many Mullahs or Imams have been invited to address the Southern Baptist Convention? I think it is a very small number.
My concern with your comments is that you seem to be very quick to criticize Rick Warren for not doing what you say you would have done. But he was the one invited, and it was no doubt based on his reputation.
Of course I believe there is urgency to the Gospel. But I believe the Holy Spirit leads us as to when, where, and how to present it. And despite some of the efforts of the SBC, one size does not fit all.
The Crusades are a rationalization for Americans to hate Muslims for 9-11? OK, I’m missing something here. My point was that the Crusades are the reason many Muslims mistrust Christians. Many, including women and children, were killed by Crusaders, who attempted conversion at the point of a sword, while others were interested in power and/or looting. That is the lens for how many in the Moslem world view Christians and Christianity. If Rick Warren’s address to the Islamic Society showed one Moslem how incorrect that is, he did well.
Thanks for the exchange, and best to you.
John
The solution to the Crusade objection is a simple one:
1. Point out that Christians like us (e.g., the Catharii) were the VICTIMS of the Crusades right alongside the Muslims.
2. Give a strong witness to the Gospel of Jesus Christ.
There is no New Testament example of anyone who advanced the gospel by being coy.
Brother John,
Just a quick response and then I am off again. It is Wednesday and I have to make certain my study is completed for tonight.
You ask; “How many Mullahs or Imams have been invited to address the Southern Baptist Convention? None, because we do not believe that Muslim truth is the same as Christian truth. The ISNA was billed as a pluralistic convention. Dr. Warren was a keynote speaker at a convention that advocated every truth was equal truth.
You say; “But he was the one invited, and it was no doubt based on his reputation.” If one’s reputation is of such that one gets an invitation to address a convention where truth is on display as equal, then that says more to one’s lack of presenting true truth.
You end by saying; “The Crusades are a rationalization for Americans to hate Muslims for 9-11? OK, I’m missing something here.” However, you move on to give the very point I am making. If you give rationalization for Muslims to view Christians as those who killed their forefathers in the crusades over hundreds of years ago, you have to give rationalization for Americans to hate Muslims because of 9/11, which happened less than 10 years ago. Of course our resident historian, Brother Bart, has certainly pointed out a historical fact that seems you have overlooked in your Crusade argument.
Blessings,
Tim
Tim & Bart,
Is a “strong Gospel witness” always the same as witnessing every time you open your mouth, even when the situation is not right?
I’d really like to hear Rick Warren’s explanation of what he said & the situation.
When you say, “Christians like us (e.g., the Catharii) were the VICTIMS of the Crusades right alongside the Muslims,” are you suggesting some sort of organic connection as the Landmarkist position holds, or simply that there are some theological similarities between 21st Century Baptists and the Catharii, hence had there been Baptists back then, the Crusaders would have persecuted us too?
My experience with prejudice suggests that saying something does not erase the prejudice; rather it is a process that requires more involvement. Race relations in Ameica would seem to affirm that.
John