Guest Author: Rev. John Mann
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John Mann has been the pastor of
After holding a blue collar job in the secular work force for ten years, I cannot tell you how humbled I was to recognize the calling of God into the ministry one lonely morning at approximately 10 a.m. Having wrestled for numerous months with the Spirit of God, it seemed quite unlikely that God would be calling me to serve his Kingdom as a minister. Nonetheless, upon that morning when time stood still, in one harrowing moment I worked up the courage to say, “Lord, here am I, send me.”
To make a long story short, I was encouraged to at least consider going to Southwestern Seminary for a tour of the campus. Quite overwhelmed and perplexed by the course of events, some 18 months later, my wife, two kids, and myself “sold it all” to follow what we believed to be the will of God. That was seven years ago. Now, I am but a few classes away from completing an Advanced Master’s of Divinity degree, something that was beyond my wildest imagination in the summer of 2000 when we abandoned all for the sake of obedience.
Entering SWBTS with nothing more than a high school diploma meant that I would have to pursue a Diploma in Theology. The years have come and gone far too quickly as I have wrestled late into the night with such subjects as Apologetics, Philosophy of Religion, Pneumatology, and so forth.
Those seven years have also provided me with any number of experiences, both positive and negative. I have known seminary couples who have divorced and I have seen many meet the love of their lives. I have said “goodbye” to as many friends as I have met. I have been confronted with ideas that were more liberal than my own, and a few that were more conservative than my own. Both have been beneficial, either to correct my own wrong thinking or teaching me to defend my right thinking. I have been on the receiving end of financial gifts from concerned administrators and have helped many international students learn how to set up a bank account or change a battery in their car. I have had Paige Patterson as a professor, and Ben Cole as a grader. Both have made unforgettable impressions for different reasons.
My years at SWBTS have offered times of unexplainable joy as well as times of heartbreaking sorrow. Perhaps, at the least, they have afforded me the privilege to speak with some sense of authority, or at least grant me the privilege to be heard. It seems there are some bloggers who have placed SWBTS directly in their sights as they have begun a big-game hunt of their own. They have left nothing sacred, attacking anything from a black lab in the presidential portrait to the President’s wife. Dr. Yarnell has, on more than one occasion been the focus of their attacks. In a desperate attempt at exposing what these bloggers perceive as foolishness, they have even taken aim at the faculty for donning black cowboy hats at Convocation. I dare not think I have the acumen to defend such men any better than they could defend themselves. Perhaps, that, in and of itself, testifies to the integrity these men have, they dare not defend themselves, rather, they have chosen the better way, “rejoice to the extent that you partake of Christ’s sufferings, that when His glory is revealed, you may also be glad with exceeding joy,” (1 Peter 4:13).
To a keen and discerning eye these childish accusations and bitter posts reveal much more about the authors than they do their subjects of attack. I have had first-hand observations of Drs. Hemphill and Patterson as President. I have heard countless chapel messages by both. I have watched both men from afar with a certain admiration and have heeded the biblical admonition to respect those in authority.I write all of the above for one reason, and that is that I may say the following within a given context. Southwestern Seminary, her President, and its faculty may not be perfect; indeed they would be the first to admit it. But one thing is for certain, I, among many others, am a better divider of the word of Truth because of the teaching of Dr. Paige Patterson and the faculty he has assembled. Dr. Patterson has demonstrated courage in the face of accusation, and Dr. Yarnell exemplifies academic excellence with evangelistic fervor. I could say such about every professor at SWBTS that I have come to know.To you dear bloggers who are championing yourselves and your efforts at reformation, you may continue to criticize and accuse as often as you wish. That is your right. But know this, your condescension of and disrespect for SWBTS will not go unanswered. There are too many men and women such as myself who will see that the more accurate side of the story is brought to light. Drs. Patterson, Yarnell, Welty, et.al., thank you for your years of service, I am a more godly man and better student of the gospel because of your labor for the Kingdom. Now, that only if I can hold the banner as high as you have demonstrated and instructed me, the
Honored to be a SWBTS alumni and student,
John Mann
26 Comments
February 21st, 2008 at 12:38 pm
john,
well said, mann….well said.
it’s always good to hear positive things amidst the negative nellies.
david
February 21st, 2008 at 1:46 pm
David,
Thanks. I for one am excited about the days ahead for the SBC.
In Christ,
John
February 21st, 2008 at 1:48 pm
John,
Thank you for your observations. I think you are correct in your observations of the “reformers” today. I believe that they have lost a great deal of credibility within the SBC because of their vitriolic and acerbic attacks. The movement is not known for what they want to reform, but that their most vocal (i.e. blogs) are nothing but attacks on anything and everything of Dr. Patterson and on the Trustee system of the SBC. That makes for a great flash in the pan, but Bible believing Baptists are not going to follow a movement that does nothing but attacks the integrity of Godly men.
Blessings,
Ron P.
February 21st, 2008 at 4:05 pm
John,
Very well said. As a graduate of Southern, and a current Th.M. student at SWBTS, all I can say is that I am so thankful for where we are today compared to where our denomination was in the year that I was born (1978). I firmly believe that there is room for greater reforms within our denomination, but not at the expense of critical attacks at leaders who in all honesty we need to be thankful for. We can be thankful that because of the influence of Dr. Patterson and others that all 6 of our seminaries have been recovered from the many dangerous errors that were once present, and with all of their current faults we can still say that they are some of the best most biblically faithful seminaries in the world.
February 21st, 2008 at 5:17 pm
Brother Jared,
I pray that your studies are going well. One month into the semester and you have completed 4 of the 7 books is amazing.
Also, your assessment of the convention to this point is spot on. You are correct, we can be thankful for the influence of Dr. Patterson and others.
Blessings,
Tim
February 21st, 2008 at 7:34 pm
Jerad and Ron,
I agree. I am much appreciative of the sacrifices of so many 30 years ago. We remain a great denomination of Biblical fidelity because of what they were willing to risk. It is a shame that some do not feel that they can disagree with a person without attacking his character. But one thing I am sure of… there are more good men and women in the SBC and her local churches than what is often demonstrated in the cyber arena.
In Christ,
John
February 21st, 2008 at 7:51 pm
Again, well said John. See you in class next Tuesday.
February 21st, 2008 at 8:43 pm
I’m glad things have gone well for you, John. I remember my studies at SWBTS with appreciation too. I also have, on my study wall, a picture of Paige and me sharing a ministry platform and have long appreciated his expositional skill.
With at least your authority then I remark that I consider the Pattersons have, sadly, made many and crass errors of judgment for which they have not shown any regret – many to do with dollars; that many of Yarnell’s (and Barber’s) contributions have been embarrassingly ill-informed and often disingenuous; that the SBC is moving into an alarming fragmentation created by unbiblical or tertiary parameters that are about power and not about truth. Very little of it all is ‘godly’ and I pray that the Lord will change or remove these men. Maybe that is beginning…
My remarks don’t make your piece wrong. It just reminds you that many of us who have genuinely admired the Pattersons and SWBTS (and been admired in return) are deeply despairing. You are very wrong to think all criticism emanates from Oklahoma.
For your part, you must sense some discomfort that your first supporting comment (1. above) comes from the producer of some of the most inane SB blogs and comments of them all.
February 21st, 2008 at 9:18 pm
John,
I am surprised you found time to write such a great article considering the amount of reading we have for “Theology of Luther.”
Anyway thank you so much for the power of your testimony. As I wrote on my blog this evening, your article is a breath of fresh air compared to some of the other writings one could find out in blog-land. Thanks again for your compelling words.
Peace be with you,
Joe Garner
February 21st, 2008 at 9:22 pm
Sorry for the random face. Not sure what happened there. Man, I wish I had a Mac.
Joe
February 21st, 2008 at 9:39 pm
Alex,
Yes, indeed my time at SWBTS has been greatly appreciated on my part. However, I would take great issue with your comment that they have shown “crass errors in judgment.” Dr. Patterson has done nothing but demonstrate great courage and longsuffering in the face of horrendous treatment. I will simply ignore your comment about Dr. Yarnell’s and Dr. Barber’s “ill-informed and disingenious” comments unless you provide some substantive reason for your accusation. Otherwise, I will consider your comment in poor taste and an error in judgment that is unbecoming of a Christian conversation. It is due to the testimony of these same men that I am quite excited and confident that the future of the SBC is one of being salt and light to a lost world. I also feel compelled to ask you where I said all criticism emanates from Oklahoma. I did not remember writing that, and after carefully inspecting my post, I still fail to find it. Finally, I have never met David, but I admire and respect his candor and conviction. Thank you immensely for the opportunity to respond. May the Lord bless you this evening.
February 21st, 2008 at 9:42 pm
Bishop Joe,
Yes, the Luther class is quite a highlight for me this semester. I much appreciate your words of encouragement.
In Christ,
John
February 21st, 2008 at 9:45 pm
Mr. Mann
Who are you?
Why are you here?
Just kidding bro. Great stuff as well.
February 21st, 2008 at 10:26 pm
Joe Stewart,
Glad to hear from you.
Mr. Who
February 22nd, 2008 at 12:43 am
John,
Thank you for the gracious tenor with which you handled the ill-informed and pejorative comment of Mr. Alex.
BTW…I know a Joe Stewart, in fact, he serves as our church’s minister of music…but who is that guy questioning your identity?:-D
Sola Gratia!
February 22nd, 2008 at 8:09 am
Scott, [and other contributors]
You are most welcome. Thank you for the opportunity to “play at your house.”
With Christ,
John
February 22nd, 2008 at 9:00 am
Brother Mann,
Thank you for the testimony of how you answer the call of God on your life. As scripture so aptly states…..
Proverbs 3:26-28 For the LORD will be your confidence And will keep your foot from being caught. (27) Do not withhold good from those to whom it is due, When it is in your power to do it. (28) Do not say to your neighbor, “Go, and come back, And tomorrow I will give it,” When you have it with you.
Also thank you for recognizing the worth of God’s encouragement through other men of the faith. It will be an astounding day, when other purveyors of the gospel begin to mature to the fact that it is fallen men that serve the ministry that God has seen fit to make known.
Raised in Texas, I made the decision not to go to SWBTS back some time ago because it grossly lacked leadership that was pointing to biblical authority. At the time, the regime was more interested in Post Modernism and its lure (those fads seem to fade fast). Even in the midst of that immature crowd, God has seen fit to produce men of God at SWBTS that are now willing to support the same institution that failed a multitude of men and women in the past. So, all things being equal, SWBTS will always have warts, but looking back over the past forty years, God has seen fit to burn off many past warts for the sake of His Word….and He is probably not finished burning warts.
The SBC World should be thankful there are more accurate signs of life,
Blessings,
Chris
February 22nd, 2008 at 10:15 am
John,
Thank you for your warm support of SWBTS, my brother. Though a NOBTS man myself, I seriously considered SW in my younger years.
Given my personal record of questioning those who took it upon themselves to assign SWBTS in general and Drs Patterson & Patterson and Yarnell specifically to the ashheap of error, ignorance and mis-management, it would surprise many that, unhappily for me, I’ve never met any of them. I just happen to know a dumb argument when I see it.
As for our Alex ’s mysterious presumption that you were speaking of Enid, John, I think is telling in itself. It seems to me that Enid’s unending flow of its vile, putred river directed toward the Pattersons and Dr. Yarnell has so thoroughly drenched our minds that when one thinks of the latter’s critics, one immediately thinks of Enid.
Hence, a well-understood slip, Alex. We know how you feel.
Grace, my friend, John. Have a great day. With that, I am…
Peter
February 22nd, 2008 at 1:21 pm
Peter,
I have followed your blog as well as read your comments elsewhere for about two years. I admired the way you handled the ungodly accusations that you faced a few months back regarding a comment of yours that was manipulated for others personal promotion. You, my friend, exemplify true Christian character. Thank you for your witness.
In Christ,
John
February 22nd, 2008 at 1:58 pm
Hi John. I enjoyed your article. I’m glad that you have benefitted from your time at Southwestern. You have worked hard, and I know that you will enjoy the rewards of that hard work soon. Congratulations.
When I was a student at Southwestern, I had a class with a professor who told me directly that he had designed the class specifically so that the majority of the students would fail. When I asked him why he would do that, he said that he wanted to send a message to the Board of Trustees that he did not agree with the direction they were taking the school. It was fun to be a pawn in the political games of an institution of higher learning.
Another professor gave me a C on a paper, and ridiculed it, and me, in front of the entire class, because I had taken a position that was opposite of the one he had taken on his doctoral thesis (my position was that the adulteress pericope in John 7:51-8:11 was not only a historical account, but that it was written by John and belongs right where it sits in the New Testament. He had a more liberal view than that).
Not all of my experiences at Southwestern were bad, just some of them. I’ve never been one to throw the baby out with the bathwater, thus I believe that your testimony makes sense. It is a good school, with good leadership, and a bright future. I only hope that the kinds of people who made my experience negative are no longer there, and that the faculty will focus on what their job is, not what they think it should be.
In light of what you have written, do you agree that it was a good thing for Dr. Klouda to have been fired? I would be curious to hear your thoughts on that, and whether it is right to ignore what some might perceive to be an injustice.
February 22nd, 2008 at 3:46 pm
Thanks John for being a voice for the thousands of students here at SWBTS that feel the same as you. I have also sat under the teaching and leadership of these men and I can say with certainty that I have a deeper understanding of God’s Word and stronger passion to proclaim God’s Word because of these men.
Also, if I may, John Mann is a person of great character. I do not know him well, but the classes I have had with him and the few times I have spoken with him he has always shown himself to be a person of character and Godliness. Thanks John for your prophetic voice.
Lewis Richerson
February 22nd, 2008 at 8:08 pm
Jason,
I am sorry that your memories are not all good. Keeping in mind that I begun SWBTS in 2000, I sat under some less than conservative teaching. I have no idea who the professors are who you are referring to, but I can assure, EVERY professor that I have had that has come in under Dr. Patterson has been nothing but a godly influence. The brilliance of many of my professors is only outshined by their humility. Love for the Lord is evidenced in every class. Of course, I have not had every professor, but as my concentration is in Theology, I have come to know most of the profs in that school very well. And that is to my benefit and pleasure.
As to the firing of Dr. Klouda, my heart breaks that her life has been an uphill battle. It saddens me that her husband suffers from health issues. Yet, the very nature of the Christian faith is one in which faith is maintained even in the face of diffuculty. The crux of the issue has been made out to be how cruel Dr. Patterson is for releasing her. In certain people’s attempts at convicting Dr. Patterson, it seems that there have been a few truths lost in the smokescreen. I would remind everybody that Dr. Klouda was not fired on the spot, but, in my understanding, was given up to two years to find another position. I would be thankful to God for two years to find another position should I ever be placed in the unfortunate position of being released. Also, we do not know the whole story. Dr. Patterson, in my opinion, has practiced great responsibility and discipline in avoiding the media circus that some have attempted to make this event out to be. He has been content to allow justice [God's, not man's] take its course. That is a great demonstration of faith and courage in my estimation. James warns us about improper uses of the tongue. It does not seem to me that the failure to heed this warning has been perpetrated on the side of Dr. Patterson. Third, Dr. Patterson was placed into a position of authority. The Biblical admonition is for us to respect those in authority, because they have been raised up by God to fill such a position. Dr. Patterson was invested with the right to make this decision by the Trustees, and he made it. It was his right and responsibility. He has told his Ecclesiology class that when he received a new authority in his life, he would go to them and offer his resignation, should they desire to accept it. That is a great demonstration of humility and faith in God’s plan for one’s life. Last, I, in no way, think that a lawsuit of this nature is proper for a group of believers. I am afraid that many fail to grasp the consequences of inviting the judicial system into ‘religious’ matters. Please note, I did not say that the Seminary is a church, but this is a religious matter and should be handled within that body. The consequences of the judicial system making judgments on private religious practices will be tragic. Thank you for your question, and I would be happy to respond further to any questions of a substantive nature. Blessings, my friend.
February 22nd, 2008 at 8:10 pm
Lewis,
Thank you for the words of encouragement. I, too, have enjoyed the far too few opportunities of fellowship that you and I have had.
February 22nd, 2008 at 8:14 pm
Well said John,
Thank You,
-Chris
February 22nd, 2008 at 8:27 pm
Chris,
Thank you. In regards to your earlier comment, I agree, when I arrived at SWBTS, there were some pockets of postmodern thinkers serving in professorial roles. I cannot think of one that I would place in that category now. To the contrary, I have learned how to effectively engage postmodern thought due to the current faculty. I assure you, that is not because of they have condemned that which they have not understood. I have had to read Derrida, Foucault, and Stanley Fish. My fear of what postmodernity would do to the church is not a fear of the unknown, but a fear of what I have read from its own constuctors.
March 14th, 2008 at 3:34 pm
John,
I enjoyed your engagement with Wade Burleson on his blog not very long ago. I have been at the seminary since 2001 I believe. I have a MDIV and I am working on a ThM now. While not every single memory or experience here at SWBTS has been positive, the vast majority have been. When I leave SWBTS I will have warm feelings about my time here.
Drs. Patterson, Yarnell, White, Welty, etc. are not perfect. And I do not agree with all their beliefs or everything they do. But I think it is a shame what is going on in the anti-establishment blogs. They are demonizing Godly men. I have learned much from them since I have been at SWBTS.
I have much respect for Patterson because of the Conservative reassurgence. I know many of the professors pretty well to very well and have found almost all of them to be models of virtue and character.
The SBC does need to change. Our churches have a lot of very spiritually immature and theologically ignorant people in them. I do not think the SBC is unique in this situation but it does need to change. However these anti Patterson and co. bloggers are making these kinds of positive changes more difficult. I have to ask why can’t we get along better for the sake of Christ and the gospel? I think we should strive to make that a goal.